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Reason.com: 59% of Republicans Now Think College Is Bad for America

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  • Reason.com: 59% of Republicans Now Think College Is Bad for America

    Only half of all Americans now have a positive view of colleges and universities, according to a new survey from Pew Research. The number of people who take a negative view has increased from 26 percent in 2012 to 38 percent in 2019.

    The change largely reflects a growing dissatisfaction on the right with the culture of college campuses. The percentage of Republicans who see value in higher education has collapsed in recent years, from 53 percent in 2012 to just 33 percent in 2019.*

    According to Pew:
    Roughly eight-in-ten Republicans (79%) say professors bringing their political and social views into the classroom is a major reason why the higher education system is headed in the wrong direction (only 17% of Democrats say the same). And three-quarters of Republicans (vs. 31% of Democrats) point to too much concern about protecting students from views they might find offensive as a major reason for their views. In addition, Republicans are more likely than Democrats to say students not getting the skills they need to succeed in the workplace is a major reason why the higher education system is headed in the wrong direction (73% vs. 56%).
    Democrats who take a negative view of higher ed are most likely to cite rising costs as the issue.

    I do not think "professors bringer their political and social views into the classroom" is a significant issue, or even necessarily a bad thing: Professors should feel free to express their opinions, even if these opinions are controversial or make some students uncomfortable. And while the ideological composition of academia is heavily tilted toward progressivism, there's little evidence that progressive professors tend to be biased against non-progressive students.

    Those concerns aside, the issues being raised by both Republican and Democratic survey respondents are valid. It's reasonable to question a system that takes young people out of the workforce at a pivotal time in their lives, saddles them with tons of debt, obliges them to learn a bunch of things they are likely to forget, gives them delusional ideas about the degree of protection from harmful speech to which they are entitled, and then churns out graduates who are overqualified for the jobs they find.

    Higher-education leaders need to be cognizant of the public's concerns. The majority of peopleóRepublicans and Democrats; whites, blacks, Asians, and Hispanicsódo not believe race should be a factor in admissions decisions, and yet some of the most elite institutional educations in the country have defiantly maintained such a practice.

    Colleges and universities are not the only major institution suffering a crisis of public confidence, of course: Pew also found that Americans increasingly take a negative view of tech companies, churches, and the media. (Banks and labor unions, on the other hand, are enjoying a relative resurgence in popularity.)

    "The partisan gaps underlying these views are reflective of our politics more broadly," writes Pew. "But views on the nation's educational institutions have not traditionally been politicized. Higher education faces a host of challenges in the futureócontrolling costs amid increased fiscal pressures, ensuring that graduates are prepared for the jobs of the future, adapting to changing technology and responding to the country's changing demographics. Ideological battles waged over the climate and culture on college campuses may make addressing these broader issues more difficult."

    Pew writes as if these "ideological" concerns are entirely unfounded. This seems wrong to me. I'll turn again to Harvard, which recently removed a law professor as faculty dean because some leftist students decided his principled defense of Harvey Weinstein's right to effective legal counsel would make the campus an unsafe place. The ACLU accused Harvard of "sacrificing principles central to our legal system."

    Disciplining Sullivan was an extremely bad decision. If it prompted some number of Americans to take an increasingly view of negative higher educationóciting concerns that administrators are coddling students and failing to prepare them for real lifeócould you really blame them?
    https://reason.com/2019/08/19/pew-su...AY_JRAaJNlUNNE
    "I guess I just hate the fact there is public property at all." - Mr. Raceboy.

  • #2
    Let's see, go $80,000 in debt for a 4 year extension of high school to avoid the real world then another $80,000 after that because there's still no job you can get with your degree in social justice all while getting daily indoctrination lessons, because let's face it, you're going to need the government to take care of you. It is a great scheme if you want to create a class ripe for a cultural revolution though.

    Hey, you are actually smart and are going to get some type of STEM degree, it's probably still worthwhile. Otherwise, you're better off learning a trade of just going to work and working your way up from the bottom. Education is a great example of why we also shouldn't subsidize healthcare. If you have a finite resource and subsidize it so everyone can buy it, you either have shortages or you have to lower the quality. Education is just as subject to the laws of economics as any other good or service.
    "Democracy is a form of worship. It is the worship of jackals by jackasses." H.L. Mencken

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    • #3
      Two out of the three kids in my family will never break even on their college debt.

      Pete (will, sooner or later)

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      • #4
        There are plenty of more affordable ways to attend college. For example, the cost of 1 year at FSU for a full-time Florida resident is $6,516 plus whatever your books cost (you can buy them used for a few hundred bucks) plus food and housing (you'd pay for food and housing regardless if you're in college). Going to a State school as a commuter student is way better in the long term than just having a high school diploma. As for worthless liberal arts degrees, I picked up a BA and MA in English, then went to law school, and it worked out OK for me. The work I did as an undergraduate literally paid my way in grad school and law school.
        "I guess I just hate the fact there is public property at all." - Mr. Raceboy.

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        • #5
          Yeah, I'm totally opposed to us having an educated populace.
          They speak in bulletpointese leftist nutjob drivel. It doesn't matter. Nothing is as great a motivator as the chance to truly be free.
          -Mr. Raceboy

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Jester View Post
            Yeah, I'm totally opposed to us having an educated populace.
            Trump doesn't want educated voters. Or they'd be smart enough not to vote for him.

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            • #7
              I think that's a general republican thing.
              01000010 01100001 01100001 00100000 01110111 01100101 01100101 01110000 00100000 01100111 01110010 01100001 01101000 01101110 01100001 00100000 01110111 01100101 01100101 01110000 00100000 01101110 01101001 01101110 01101110 01111001 00100000 01100010 01101111 01101110 01100111

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              • #8
                Isnít anyone going to talk about the reason for the belief?

                According to Pew:
                Roughly eight-in-ten Republicans (79%) say professors bringing their political and social views into the classroom is a major reason why the higher education system is headed in the wrong direction (only 17% of Democrats say the same). And three-quarters of Republicans (vs. 31% of Democrats) point to too much concern about protecting students from views they might find offensive as a major reason for their views. In addition, Republicans are more likely than Democrats to say students not getting the skills they need to succeed in the workplace is a major reason why the higher education system is headed in the wrong direction (73% vs. 56%).
                Undergraduate at UCLA I found my professors possessed extraordinarily liberal views from experience. Law school not so much. It would be nice if economics were a class in high school and/or, taken by more students.

                Dan (agrees liberalism is rampant at colleges)
                HFM

                As long as there exists people with religion and a belief in God, there will never be a Libertarian state.

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                • #9
                  Isn't it contradictory to say there's too much concern about protecting students from offensive viewpoints while at the same time saying the professor's liberal viewpoints are offensive?
                  "I guess I just hate the fact there is public property at all." - Mr. Raceboy.

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                  • #10
                    If most republicans don't think college is necessary, then obviously there aren't going to be very many republican college professors.
                    Last edited by Jeff92se; 08-22-2019, 03:38 PM.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by skooly View Post
                      Isn't it contradictory to say there's too much concern about protecting students from offensive viewpoints while at the same time saying the professor's liberal viewpoints are offensive?
                      I had a hard time understanding that comment about three-quarters versus 31%. On its face, the statement seems to mean that there should not be a concern about protecting students from views they would find offensive. Does this mean there should be presentation of views that they would find offensive? And, if so, are those conservative views? Does these mean conservatives views are offensive and, that they should be presented with equal time?

                      I donít know the answer to the above but, to the portion that is clear, I do find colleges liberal generally speaking and that those views are passed on to students, right or wrong. Donít you?
                      HFM

                      As long as there exists people with religion and a belief in God, there will never be a Libertarian state.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by hfm View Post

                        I had a hard time understanding that comment about three-quarters versus 31%. On its face, the statement seems to mean that there should not be a concern about protecting students from views they would find offensive. Does this mean there should be presentation of views that they would find offensive? And, if so, are those conservative views? Does these mean conservatives views are offensive and, that they should be presented with equal time?

                        I donít know the answer to the above but, to the portion that is clear, I do find colleges liberal generally speaking and that those views are passed on to students, right or wrong. Donít you?
                        Conservative views which are scientifically incorrect do not deserve equal time in courses regarding the underlying science. For example, the position that god created the heavens and the earth some few thousand years ago doesn't deserve equal time in an anthropology or geology class, while it may be deserving of some time in relevant classes on history, religion, society or culture.

                        The fact that conservatives are offended that "intelligent design" doesn't get equal treatment as "natural selection" in biology courses is no reason to change those disciplines or how they are taught. Presenting the "conservative views" with equal time wouldn't be merely offensive, but false and contradictory to the course of study. Scientific progress requires an anti-conservative bias.

                        dusty (notes that demagogue-led and authoritarian movements almost always engage in anti-intellectualism and the derision of learned "elites")

                        For every ailment under the sun - There is a remedy, or there is none;
                        If there be one, try to find it; If there be none, never mind it. -- Mother Goose

                        "We've always assumed that you can't bring back the dead. But it's a matter of when you pickle the cells." -- Peter Rhee

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by dusty View Post
                          Conservative views which are scientifically incorrect do not deserve equal time in courses regarding the underlying science. For example, the position that god created the heavens and the earth some few thousand years ago doesn't deserve equal time in an anthropology or geology class, while it may be deserving of some time in relevant classes on history, religion, society or culture.

                          The fact that conservatives are offended that "intelligent design" doesn't get equal treatment as "natural selection" in biology courses is no reason to change those disciplines or how they are taught. Presenting the "conservative views" with equal time wouldn't be merely offensive, but false and contradictory to the course of study. Scientific progress requires an anti-conservative bias.

                          dusty (notes that demagogue-led and authoritarian movements almost always engage in anti-intellectualism and the derision of learned "elites")
                          Not all conservative are religious conservative. Nice stereotyping.
                          "Democracy is a form of worship. It is the worship of jackals by jackasses." H.L. Mencken

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by dusty View Post
                            Conservative views which are scientifically incorrect do not deserve equal time in courses regarding the underlying science. For example, the position that god created the heavens and the earth some few thousand years ago doesn't deserve equal time in an anthropology or geology class, while it may be deserving of some time in relevant classes on history, religion, society or culture.

                            The fact that conservatives are offended that "intelligent design" doesn't get equal treatment as "natural selection" in biology courses is no reason to change those disciplines or how they are taught. Presenting the "conservative views" with equal time wouldn't be merely offensive, but false and contradictory to the course of study. Scientific progress requires an anti-conservative bias.

                            dusty (notes that demagogue-led and authoritarian movements almost always engage in anti-intellectualism and the derision of learned "elites")
                            This is stupid. Literally nobody is complaining about there not being enough religion in college-level anthropology courses. The liberalism they complain about is when you don't feel free to write a research paper about the men's rights movement because the professor will automatically assume you're some kind of bigot. But I'm sure you know that already.
                            DEEZ NUTS FOR PRESIDENT!!

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Jesse View Post

                              This is stupid. Literally nobody is complaining about there not being enough religion in college-level anthropology courses. The liberalism they complain about is when you don't feel free to write a research paper about the men's rights movement because the professor will automatically assume you're some kind of bigot. But I'm sure you know that already.
                              you sound like the problem is you need college to be a venue to express your opinion about the men's rights movement without fear of judgment; like, a "safe space" ;-)

                              I disagree with everything you posted. there clearly has been and continues to be an anti-science movement in education pushed by the religious right for at least 30 years. I suggest that influence intensifies the results dramatically on the republican side of this survey.

                              I said what I meant -- don't tell me what was on my mind because that is merely your imagination. In the right course, I would hope a good paper on the men's right's movement would be reviewed appropriately. But intelligent design is not going to be taught equally with darwin, climate-change denial is not going to get the same resources as actual climate science, flat-earth geometry and physics will not be taught along-side real astronomy. So the religious conservatives (who if not all republicans, have zero democrats) are mad and will continue to be mad. And I think they should not get equal time and resources just for their feelings about it.

                              My comment was examples of certain conservative views which don't deserve "equal time". I expressed no comment on whether the men's rights movement or other issues deserve equal time, and nothing in my comment states or suggests that every conservative view should be suppressed. But some conservative views (particularly the anti-science alternate theories), they don't deserve equal time.

                              I also noted that the reactionary right always derides the liberal academia, and so the rise in anti-college sentiment numbers in the GOP aligns pretty well with the rise of the influence of the far right, the reactionary right, in the trump era
                              For every ailment under the sun - There is a remedy, or there is none;
                              If there be one, try to find it; If there be none, never mind it. -- Mother Goose

                              "We've always assumed that you can't bring back the dead. But it's a matter of when you pickle the cells." -- Peter Rhee

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